Early HPE restoration

[peteracs]

There is no rushing John the body guy…..

Will be really interesting to see what comes back from stripping, though it is the frame only, the doors will not be included to reduce the risk associated with residual moisture etc.

Peter

[peteracs]

Car due to go off to strippers next week now. Just a few photos of the joining points of the two halves, not especially interesting, but just wanted to keep a record. What was sort of interesting was where the sills join, the inner parts where the carpet lays are different profiles, so he had to cut out sections from the front of the HPE to allow it to marry up ok. All looks very rough and ready to my eye, but this is to get it through the stripping process and then they can really get to work on it.

One point John made was that they are staggering the welds where strength is needed such as on the window surround so we do not have a single point of possible weakness.

Peter

[peteracs]

On another topic I mentioned before, I was going to look at using a Programmable Distribution Module instead of the conventional fuse box/relay setup. After spending some time looking into them I have decided that the cost and potential for being stranded really make it not an avenue I want to go down. I also was as part of this looking to consolidate all the dash switches into one Canbus interface which was possible at not too an expensive route, but you need something to talk to and decode it, which I would not have without some serious effort, so that has also been knocked on the head at least for now.

One question I do have is has anyone relocated their fuse box etc into the passenger footwell? I found one of the control modules in the IE in there and it looks a likely place to house it, even if I have to sacrifice some or all of the glovebox space. This would eliminate the worry about engine location and hence environmental issues and get rid of the spaghetti above the steering wheel hopefully.

I had toyed with the idea of a new original fuse box out of a facelift car, but they are pretty expensive to buy so was looking at a more generic one where you can add relay modules and you wire it yourself, so giving flexibility in wire sizes etc. They also use the blade style fuses which personally I prefer.

Any comments/ideas would be appreciated…….

[WestonE]

Hi Peter

Re-wiring to modern Distribution is a bravery step too far for me. I did of course take trouble to keep Modern added systems on their own loom with appropriate relays and blade fuses. I should probably have used micro relays to save a lot of space. With the full spec ECU it is a LOT of wiring and not actually finished thanks to my house move trauma.

Of course if you understand the OE wiring and it's flaws it is perfectly possible to change the wiring layout and lengths to put relays and fuses in the glove box area. Earlier cars are easier because you do not have the interconnect snakes nest inside the fuse box to decode. I went for a new OE late fuse box and built a new loom in thicker thin wall cable if in doubt adding relays to the well known OE error areas. I will be building a heat shield to reduce the damage done by the exhaust that has most late cars running brittle wires.

Eric     

[SanRemo78]

I'm aware of the fusebox weaknesses in the Beta loom and also issues that arose in the Stratos replica by putting loads through the column stalks so for my restoration I'm also considering a complete rewire to include relocation of fusebox to inside the car but going with a Car Builder Solutions fusebox. I'm also looking at adding an ABS system to the car....

After rewiring the Stratos one circuit at a time I no longer see spaghetti as the nightmare it might appear! Good solid earth points are essential and I will be going with ring terminals bolted down rather than the spade type bathing points..

Getting the original fusebox away from the heat and moisture in the engine bay is a positive move. Go for it! Is losing the glovebox an issue? The only thing I keep in the Alfa glovebox is a torch and fire extinguisher. There's plenty of space for those elsewhere. It's probably where I'm going to put my fusebox, especially if it can be done with a false back.

Guy

[peteracs]

Hi Guy

Not precious about glovebox. On the Spider I have a USB point for phone charging and not much else.

Just waiting for a 16 fuse/7 micro relay unit which appears widely available inc Car Builders. That should give me an idea how practical it is to fit there. Main obstacle in that area is the brake mech which sits behind the servo.

Peter

[peteracs]

Just been informed body is off to strippers so nervous 4 weeks to see what we have left. Out to lunch with some old friends the other day. One of which has a brother who recently bought an old Alfa Spider. Spent £18k on it and has just had it dipped. Result is a body which needs 500 hours plus loads of new panels thus making it questionable about going further. Hopefully the HPE will not be in that league!!!

Peter

[peteracs]

Sorry, boring photo again, but arrived at strippers….

[peteracs]

On a possibly more interesting note, the fuse box and relay strip arrived. I was amazed how small they are, not sorted out all the yellow plastic pieces yet, but looks to be good for the job. Also you can cascade them as the mounting feet can be removed and any number can be clipped together. They also supply one for more normal size relays, though you only get 4 relays in the strip. The connectors appear rated for up to 2.5mm cable, so will cover most of the requirements in the car.

Peter

[WestonE]

Hi Peter

The same MTA kit I have used from Pole Volt and Vehicle Wiring Products to make up ECU Fuse Boxes except of course I should have saved space by using the micro relay versions.

Eric
I also use AMP 6 way Power distribution blocks to avoid the bundle of wires hanging off the battery terminals.   

[peteracs]

Hi Eric

I will look into those blocks, thanks.

Following on from the wiper entry in the electrical section. I now have an intermittent relay and a mountable holder for it. These are made by Hella, but have seen others from Bosch and a brand called Cargo. They also fit lesser pinned cube relays and can be connected together, so a possible solution for normal size relays such as flasher units.

Peter

[peteracs]

Hi

Visited Prostrip Nottingham today as the body has been dipped and is now ready for collection. No great surprises which is a relief as there is enough work to do that we knew of. Should be collected in the next few days and hopefully the work can get started. Main work will be the rear strut towers which are pretty bad as well as new inner sills etc.

Here are a few really bad photos as the unit was badly lit.

Peter

[peteracs]

Slight tangent. On the Spider I never wanted any audio system as I speculated the noise from outside and wind would make having a sound system pretty redundant. I was pretty much correct, so happy with it as is.

On the HPE however I am hoping for a much more quiet cabin and will be going some way to trying to help things along with sound proofing etc and incorporating some sort of basic sound system so I can have music/radio. However on the pre facelift dash there is no real provision for a conventional radio unless you either replace the ashtray or use a fairly rare radio add on (which I may have in my parts boxes!). I am unwilling to use either of these solution and also would prefer to use my phone as the source and use a Bluetooth amplifier hidden behind the dash with maybe a hidden, but accessible volume/on/off knob. To that end I watched a video on a simple amp being used and searched for one on Ebay. Turned out to be £10, delivered in 2 days and just works. So will be a good basis as a starter for 10 to see how effective this can be.

As for speakers the situation is interesting as I now have the choice of positioning them near the bottom of the A pillar or in the doors as the new front end is from a later car, whereas the original only had provision in the door. I will most likely go for a pair of decent combination speakers (ie single piece with both tweeter and low/mid range speakers in one). I realise this will be a compromise, but HiFi quality is not really my aim, just something that is acceptable for longer journeys. Photo of the amp I bought below. I tested it with a pair of my HiFi speakers using a 12V source and it sounded quite acceptable.

[peteracs]

Hi

Well I finally started on the massive clean/refurbish/paint all the suspension and braking parts for the car. Cleaning is a mix of getting old oil and crud off, wire wheeling and then painting the appropriate parts. For the Spider I simply used Hammerite and was not wholly happy with the lasting power, so this time I am treating the rust with a rust modifier (Vactan), using a primer, then Hammerite and we will see if that proves to be a better solution.

Todays work involved finish painting the one rear dust cover, drilling out two broken bolts and thread clearing the mounting holes for the rear brake dust covers in the rear hubs. Removing the anti roll bar bushes in the rear hubs, one pressed out, the other had to be drilled/cut and removing one of the bushes from the rear adjustable link arms, again drill and cut as the press would not budge it.

Really good to be doing something constructive now.

Peter

[peteracs]

Started on the refurbishing of the brake calipers whilst waiting for some thinners to allow cleaning of the brushes which I use for the primer. I have several of both front and back calipers and was not looking forward to removing the bleed nipples, all were rusty. I started by applying heat and then trying to loosen with a simple 8mm socket and ratchet, result was one came loose, the others felt like they might snap. I therefore thought the rattle gun may help on lowest setting. Result was absolutely no movement, so moved to middle setting and hey presto movement. This was repeated on approx 8 calipers I found in my store with only one previously broken nipple and one which broke with the gun. My technique once they had started moving was to reduce the gun to min setting which was plenty to get the nipples out. So I have a good choice of bodies, the next task is remove the yokes which from memory involves a lot of hammering……. After that see which of the pistons I can reuse. I have a pair of new rear pistons and complete seal sets for all round the car. I also have stainless bleed nipples to replace the original steel ones.

Peter

[peteracs]

Brakes put to one side until I get my parts washer sorted, debating over liquid, decisions, decisions…..

So carried on cleaning a few parts of the suspension, treated with rust converter and finished priming some of the other parts previously treated.

After having enough of the noise and muck from wire wheeling the suspension parts, I decided in the last hour to strip down one of the two power steering racks I have. This makes the manual rack rack look oh so simple. Eventually after various head scratching moments I managed to completely disassemble it. The rack I chose to do this on was one which I bought at the 50th and seller said it had blown seals due to moving the car without the engine on. Is this actually true that on these power steering racks you can blow a seal by moving the car without having the pump active? Seems a bit of a failing of the design to my mind. I did find a damaged seal and wonder if it actually had been refurbished and the seal was damaged during re assembly and just happened to go at a point in time which pointed to steering with the pump off.

I am going to arrange all the parts and take a photo of the correct arrangement for future reference, because I will forget….

Peter

[peteracs]

Photos of the disassembled power steering rack, as mentioned so what more complex than the manual one…..

[WestonE]

Hi Peter

I use Comma Hyper Clean in my Parts washer which comes in 25 liter drums. Gloves should be worn but it really does work when water based alternatives do not. Note Plastic or rubber parts should not be exposed to this stuff for long or they will swell and degrade.

Eric

On PS Racks. What Fun! As you say more likely installation error than using without the full system in place unless dirt is allowed in. Mine does have Some ATF in it with the pipes in a loop until the engine is in. This keeps dirt out and provides some lubrication. 

[peteracs]

Hi Eric

Yes, keeping the connections clean during installation is a good thought. The rack you see here came with a couple of original bungs which I guess came on the replacement rack which the seller replaced it with.

I have opted for a water based liquid for the parts washer, hopefully will be successful if not take longer to achieve the finish I need, bonus is washing the parts after is ok as bio degradable.

I have seen reports of heating the water based solutions helps with its effectiveness, will see how it goes without that.

Peter

[peteracs]

Hi, as well as collecting/delivering the block today, I also visited Simply Wheels at Lincoln with the 5 Cromodora wheels I am aiming to use on the car. These are the alternative style ones to the standard Beta wheels which I always thought suited the HPE. I asked for bright silver finish, so will see what that looks like. I picked this company as they do a complete job on the wheels, acid dip etc, rather than a lot of companies who advertise locally, including mobile guys where to my mind it is a quick tart up of the wheel which would last a short while before the finish degrades. I failed to find anyone else locally who specialises in doing them. The local guy I used for the Spider is no longer in business I found when I visited where his premises were.

My aim is to buy tyres when we get to the point of actually needing them which is most likely sometime next year.

Peter