Crank Pulley Removal

[anotherdeadhero]

Thanks for the tip off Eric, I've just bought one.

Running a compressor isn't really an option for me in a densly overlooked residential area.

Going for £299 here:
https://powertoolsdirect.oxatis.com/PBSCProduct.asp?ItmID=12162234

Andy

[mangocrazy]

Thanks for all the comments; much appreciated. I must admit I got severe tool envy seeing Eric's Milwaukee impact wrench - that really looks a beast. Anyway after mulling it over yesterday evening I decided to winch the engine into the van and bring it back to Sheffield. At my lockup garage there is no power, and no realistic means of getting any, short of hiring a generator.

This means that I can now run an extension cable from the house out to the roadside and either keep the compressor topped up and running by leaving it permanently on, or my Clarke mains electric impact gun can join the party (this one):

https://www.machinemart.co.uk/p/clarke-cew1000-electric-impact-wrench

Reading the reviews make me vaguely optimistic that it will do the job; it's certainly chewed trough everything else I've put before it. It doesn't have quite the grunt of Eric's Milwaukee, but I live in hope.

One way or another, that crank pulley nut is coming off...

[WestonE]

Graham

Also use some heat on the nut from a blow torch if it still refuses to give up.

Good Luck

Eric

[mangocrazy]

It's off.

In the end, it only took about 10 seconds with the Clarke mains electric airgun to shift it. All very undramatic, it just came off. So electric trumps air in this case. Proof shown below.

With the (very heavy) triple groove crank pulley off, I was able to turn my attention to other stuff. The first thing was to see if the water pump pulley off the seized carb engine would fit. It wouldn't - there was a sensor bolted to a metal bracket with a pointer that was in the way. I guessed that it was something along the lines of a crank position sensor for the injection engine, and decided to take it off. With it off the carb water pump pulley fitted perfectly and lined up with the carb crank pulley. The sensor is shown in the second (also visible in the previous photo). Can anyone confirm if my diagnosis was correct ot not?

I then lined up the various pulleys and marked them with Tippex ready to change the belt. When the crank pulley was lined up exactly with its alignment mark, the aux pulley looked about half a tooth off. Is this an acceptable level of variance, or is something amiss? (And before anyone mentions it I will very definitely be changing the idler bearing...)

And lastly, with the crank pulley lined up correctly, one of the camwheels looked a bit off, as well. Is cambelt changing an exact science, or is there a bit of leeway?

But anyway, at least I feel like I've made some real progress. And while I had electric power available I got the multitool sander out and gave the flywheel drive face a good clean up, followed up with plenty of brake cleaner and scrubbing.

[rossocorsa]

I think you'll find your air tool probably isn't well matched to your compressor (compressor too small relative to air consumption of the tool) a friend recently had the opposite his electric tool wouldn't shift it but my air tool took out of in seconds

[mangocrazy]

I think you'll find your air tool probably isn't well matched to your compressor (compressor too small relative to air consumption of the tool) a friend recently had the opposite his electric tool wouldn't shift it but my air tool took out of in seconds

Yes, I'd agree, The tool is pro quality, the compressor is hobby quality. I should really have given the air tool another go with a compressor that could replenish itself first, but it was just easier to get stuck in with the electric gun.

[Neil-yaj396]

I think you will be alright with that belt alignment, certainly from the point of not causing any damage. I once got the belt one tooth out on my ie and had to move it after start up.

Plenty of dry turning of the engine after fitting, but you know that!

[lukasdeopalenica]

The sensor at the crankshaft is for digiplex ignition system, used not in all injected engines. Mine has the standard type electronic ignition system without these sensors (some models have also camshaft position sensor).
I would try to readjust the exhaust pulley, as it looks to be a bit misaligned. The auxiliary pulley looks ok.

[WestonE]

Graham

Remove the Sensor from the Pointer and re-fit the pointer so you have a TDC pointer. You will be needing one with a clear mark on the pulley you are using for ignition timing. You can have un-used outer pulleys machined off fairly easily which saves weight and makes re-fitting the engine easier.

Cheers

Eric

[mangocrazy]

Thanks, chaps. I'm definitely going to try and get things to line up a bit better than at present when I fit the new belt (especially the ex camwheel), but I won't be too upset if I have to go with how it is now.

Perhaps I need to clarify the water pump pulley issue; I've taken off all the pulleys from the carb engine and intend to use them on the i.e. engine. The pulleys on the i.e. engine are well over the top for my needs and would make an already crowded area of the engine bay even more so. My problem was with clearance on the carb water pump pulley with the sensor and pointer fitted. The pointer fouled the back of the water pump pulley. Unfortunately I don't have the i.e. pulley at hand to compare - that's languishing unloved in the lockup in Stafford.

When I transfer the block mounted distributor over to the i.e. engine I'm fully prepared to have to use a dial gauge to determine TDC. With the engine out it should hopefully be easier than with it in situ. However when I get to that point I will definitely be back asking more questions, as the Haynes manual seems to completely overlook the possibility that someone might need to set the ignition timing on an engine with electronic ignition. It's well covered for engines with points, but thankfully mine has electronic ignition. (I hate contact breaker points with a passion...)

[mangocrazy]

Finally got a chance to do some more work on the engine today. The engine is covered (inside a van), but I'm standing or kneeling outside, so it's no fum working on it when it's raining (or snowing as it was yesterday). Anyway the weather was kind today and progress was made. In fact everything went together so smoothly I'm actually a bit shocked.

The new idler bearing fitted perfectly in the housing after it had been cleaned and plated, and the belt went on as easy as. I even managed to get the inlet and exhaust cam pulleys lined up pretty much spot on with the pointers. The first photo is with belt on but not tightened.

As you can see everything lines up nicely. The aux pulley is slightly off, but I'd rather expected that to be the case. And the second photo is with belt tightened and crank and water pump pulley fitted. I used Loctite 243 on the crank nut, the idler bearing nut and the water pump bolts. Possibly overkill, but I prefer it that way.

So hopefully at the weekend it's back down to Stafford and get the engine reunited with clutch and gearbox. Here's hoping that my current run of good fortune continues...

[lukasdeopalenica]

Looks perfect. Did you retightened the crank nut by hand or with air gun?
I am wondering why has Lancia changed cam pulleys from holed ones (like the aux pulley) to full? They are not only weavier, but also ugly...   

[peteracs]

Looks perfect. Did you retightened the crank nut by hand or with air gun?
I am wondering why has Lancia changed cam pulleys from holed ones (like the aux pulley) to full? They are not only weavier, but also ugly...   

Are the cam pulleys plastic on the later engines?

Peter

[mangocrazy]

Hi Lukas, I retightened the crank pulley using an air gun. It seemed the easiest way to do it, given the problems I've had locking the flywheel previously. You can't know the exact torque you're using by that method, which is why I used Loctite as well. And I agree, the lightened aux pulley looks much better and loses a bit of weight compared to the plain one.

All the pulleys on this engine were steel, Peter. It's an i.e. engine with power steering pump fitted, so reasonably late.

[anotherdeadhero]

Looking good!

Graham

This is too late now you have bought a tool but it might help others. I use this cordless tool from Milwaukee. It delivers 610Nm of torque and does not need mains power or a compressor. I also own a BIG compressor driven tool and the Milwaukee is still better and does not need a 3HP compressor to drive it. It states the most powerful 18V cordless impact wrench on the market.

HD18HIWF-402 M18 Heavy Duty Cordless Friction Ring Impact Wrench - See more at: http://www.milwaukeepowertools.co.uk/hd18hiwf-402-m18-heavy-duty-cordless-friction-ring-impact-wrench#sthash.bKPO9pcU.dpuf

 http://www.milwaukeepowertools.co.uk/hd18hiwf-402-m18-heavy-duty-cordless-friction-ring-impact-wrench

Sorry I did not provide this earlier.

Eric

Thanks for the tip off Eric, I've just bought one.

Running a compressor isn't really an option for me in a densely overlooked residential area.

Going for £299 here:
https://powertoolsdirect.oxatis.com/PBSCProduct.asp?ItmID=12162234

Andy

Just a quick update: I've been using this rattle gun a lot this weekend. It is the best bit of kit I've bought yet. Brilliant.

[lukasdeopalenica]

Are the cam pulleys plastic on the later engines?

At least mine are steel.

[Inertia]

Any tips on how to remove the nut that retains the cambelt pulley on the crank?  I own many sockets but none for that key feature.

Second question - is there a part number on that alternator drive pulley?  If it has the right offset I may want one for my Zagato engine project.

[peteracs]

Hi

You need a 36mm socket for the crank nut and ideally use a rattle gun which makes it simple normally....

Sorry no idea on the alternator p/n, I just bought a complete unit.

Peter

[rossocorsa]

Hi

You need a 36mm socket for the crank nut and ideally use a rattle gun which makes it simple normally....

Sorry no idea on the alternator p/n, I just bought a complete unit.

Peter

I think 36mm is the drive shaft nut, crankshaft pulley nut 38mm or 1.5 inch

[peteracs]

Hi Alan

Damn, you are correct, I had the 36mm for the drive shaft and had to buy the 38mm.....

Thanks

Peter