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Title: No spark from coil on IE - Sorted; Poor running - Not Post by: lanciamad on February 11, 2010, 10:59:22 AM The cars not been running right ever since the day before I had it rolling roaded, as if it's missing a cylinder occasionally, and at cruising speeds 2.5 - 3k rpm, wouldn't pull without hesitating and then pick up, it also back fired on one occasion.
Anyone thats read or been following the blog, may have read about the last track day I did where the car cut out twice, well that problems returned again, after checking the plugs and found one of them loose I thought i'd found the problem of it running rough but no and now its cut out and the coils not sparking :( Yesterday I took the plugs out and replaced with new to see if it made any difference to the running, but it didn't, was going to then check the HT leads were all sparking, as well as the plugs, but holding it at 3k it suddenly died and cut out, went to start again, no luck, checked the lead off the coil and its not sparking. Ignition amplifier is about two years old, coil old, dizzy old. Should I be looking at these as the fault as they work in a loop, or am I looking at the feed to the coil? Help ;D I'm guna have another crack at solving the problem today, so i'll update tonight with pics. so people know what i'm on about. Title: Re: No spark from coil on IE Post by: mark on February 11, 2010, 02:36:53 PM Could the problem be at the Ignition Switch ? Ive come accross this on some Fords, the plastic switch gear at the back of the ignition barrel wears and makes and breaks contact at different speeds due to a bit of vibration. may be worth a look at ? Good luck !! Cheers Mark.
Title: Re: No spark from coil on IE Post by: lanciamad on February 11, 2010, 08:27:29 PM The good news is, i've got it running, the bad news is, its still running rough.
(http://i135.photobucket.com/albums/q152/lanciamad_album/Photo0276.jpg) I don't think it was the switch as there was a 12v feed to the coil when the ignition was turned on. (http://i135.photobucket.com/albums/q152/lanciamad_album/Photo0277.jpg) I had a spare distributor with a newly fitted pick-up so I fitted this and turned by hand, no spark, got a spare coil and fitted that and it sparked readily and well, fitted the original coil to check it was duff and it didn't create a spark so it's binned. So the cutting out business before must have been the coil dieing it's death ??? As well as this I checked the connections that have been "repaired" by a garage from dizzy to ignition amplifier and they looked like this when I peeled back all the insulation tape :o (http://i135.photobucket.com/albums/q152/lanciamad_album/Photo0279.jpg) (http://i135.photobucket.com/albums/q152/lanciamad_album/Photo0278.jpg) So it's sparking and running, but roughly with the occasional miss it sounds like. The timing will need checking now as it's got another distributor fitted, but I think i've got it running pretty close without being perfect. It now however is idleing at 1.5k rpm and nothing has been changed other than the coil and distributor, it's running rough just as before where it's pretty poor to pick up initially and then anything above 3k rpm goes like a rocket, i'm a bit stumped really :-\ List of things which I know are ok: Spark plugs HT leads Coil Dizzy Fuel Pump and fuel filter - 6 months old Which is which of the two sensors on the top water rail (blue and cream)? Is there a sensor at fault? If running rich would this cause the fast idling, poor running but rocket light performance above 3k rpm. Anyone got any ideas ??? Title: Re: No spark from coil on IE - Sorted; Poor running - Not Post by: lanciamad on February 11, 2010, 08:35:40 PM Some poor quality vids. from my phone:
Lancia Beta HPE - Poor running 1 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4GRpfu7ZQw8#) Lancia Beta HPE Poor Running 2 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m5a6DfZqh4Q#) Idle set from the then running 1.5k rpm down to 1k rpm: Lancia Beta HPE poor running 3 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_D--gVcs38A#) Title: Re: No spark from coil on IE - Sorted; Poor running - Not Post by: lanciamad on February 12, 2010, 05:01:11 PM Had another go today (http://www.cool-smileys.com/images/2066.gif) (http://www.cool-smileys.com/smiley-banging-head-against-the-wall)
Took everything off and checked the pipework, everything seemed to be ok, (unfortunately in one way)... (http://i135.photobucket.com/albums/q152/lanciamad_album/Photo0290.jpg) (http://i135.photobucket.com/albums/q152/lanciamad_album/Photo0291.jpg) What I did find was the TPS wasn't upto much at idle as it looked like this... (http://i135.photobucket.com/albums/q152/lanciamad_album/Photo0293.jpg) So bent the bottom piece back to somewhere handy so that it contacts when fully off throttle but lifts off the moment any throttles given... (http://i135.photobucket.com/albums/q152/lanciamad_album/Photo0295.jpg) And full throttle... (http://i135.photobucket.com/albums/q152/lanciamad_album/Photo0294.jpg) This seems to still have no effect on the running as its still rough, and the back firing is increasing if anything, suggesting that its running way to rich ??? I tried fitting a spare air flow meter and adjusting the CO2 screw back and forth but still no effect to the I believe richness, is there a sensor at fault making it run rich constantly causing the occasional blip at idleing, poor running at lower revs/under load and back firing when off throttle revs returning to idle ??? ??? ??? Can someone also confirm what the four sensors are and do, two in cylinder head and two on top water rail please? I've had a look through the haynes and other info, from what I make out, the two in the cylinder head are water temp gauge and warning light gauge? What are the other two in the water rail for that go to the ecu? When disconnecting the cream colour, engine cuts out, should it?... Video0017.3gp (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pqunB6HYmI0#) Just thinking a faulty water temp sensor may make it run rich constantly? Title: Re: No spark from coil on IE - Sorted; Poor running - Not Post by: thecolonel on February 12, 2010, 07:48:17 PM From what I remember from my HPE IE days, sensors in water rail are cold start sensor and ecu temp sensor.
I seem to remember that the TPS on the Beta system (unlike modern inj) is either idle or full throttle and not variable, also injectors all fire at once not individually. I would disconnect the blue plug on the cold start injector and see if that makes a difference, if that doesn't help check the resistance of the temp sensors at cold and hot Brown plug sensor info : 11.80 - 12v 40w - 35 deg C 8 sec. - part no: 0280130214 Bosch Geoff |