Lancia Beta Forum

There seems to be a steady stream (including from myself) of requests for replacement suspension struts, particularly for Coupes. Has the time not come to source a reliable supply of these items amongst ourselves?
I noticed that Rosso Corsa had some handsome yellow struts fitted as part of his resto, where were these from?
I've had no trouble sourcing a full set of NOS inserts, but at least two of my struts (the leaky ones of course!) are sealed units. I know that Betaboyz offer a conversion part but assume that this involves some element of machining?
All comments welcome.

quite a few have appeared on ebay :

http://shop.ebay.co.uk/?_from=R40&_trksid=p5197.m570.l1313&_nkw=lancia+beta+shock+absorbers&_sacat=See-All-Categories (http://shop.ebay.co.uk/?_from=R40&_trksid=p5197.m570.l1313&_nkw=lancia+beta+shock+absorbers&_sacat=See-All-Categories)

Geoff

Geoff

Yeah, when you read it though they're just the inserts, as I said these are pretty easy to get hold of, it's the struts themselves that are the problem.

Neil

my struts are definitely Orange (konis!! quite scarce these days) I think you are confusing another members rebuild

Has anyone looked at Tipo/Dedra/155 struts? I have a pair in the shed and they look very similar to Beta front struts. I haven't had a chance to compare them side by side yet. They might at least be adaptable and would give a current (almost) supply of replacements.

Cheers R

I don't think they are anything similar I had a dedra turbo and later a delta hpe hf and don't recall the struts being anything like Beta ones

Well I just went out and had a look. They are different, the Beta hub carrier's strut mounting upstand is a couple of mm thicker and the clamp bolt centres are a couple of mm further apart than the 155's. The angle of the bolts is probably slightly different too so the camber would be cocked up. I dare say the strut body brackets could be spread and the holes altered to suit.

I recently had some X1/9 coilover struts made up by AVO. You will see they now offer them in their range of conversion kits. They are around £600 for the four. Would that be an option?

I also have the assistance of a large fabrication/machining company, as I do a bit of design work for them. I could possibly get new strut bodies made to suit modern standardised inserts from the likes of Koni and Bilstein. They will be making some adjustable top mounts for me soon, which is something else people might be interested in.

Are you saying AVO actually fabricate new struts to order?

my struts are definitely Orange (konis!! quite scarce these days) I think you are confusing another members rebuild
[/quote]

Yeah, must be a touch of colour blindness, it was definately your car. I take it that the Koni struts aren't still generally available?

Yes of course. AVO, Leda, Gaz and the like will all make struts to order. They won't be cheap, but they will make bodies able to take standard diameter inserts and springs, or rebuildable coilovers if you want that type.

Unfortunately there will be no cheap/easy solution if spares are no longer mass produced.  For me, if I were going to spend on making struts rebuildable I would go for adjustable coilovers. Then there is no need for bespoke "lowering" springs; you can choose suitable rate springs off the shelf and set your ride height and firmness as you wish.

What exactly do people want? If we are looking for a source of strut body conversion parts as offered in the shop, I can probably get them, or even get strut bodies converted, at a reasonable price. If people want coilovers at around £600 a set, I will happily take a couple of struts to AVO and get some made, all they need is a pattern.

Rachael

Excellent post and just what I need. I have already rang Leda and been told £1400 for a car set of coilovers!! I am building a serious engine for this car so coilovers with adjustable bump/rebound and 2.5inch springs on adjustable platforms are important. As is front end camber adjustment to introduce 1.5 - 2.5 negative camber on my Power Steer VX Beta Spyder. If AVO can design in an ecentric cam on the top hub hole as we use on Montecarlos with Ledas that would be great. On the rear camber adjustment can be achieved by using 4 adjustable links not 2 pressed 2 adjustable. I have Beta Boyz poly moulded rear strut top mounts and these might need a different top unit to nest the coilover spring. Please PM me as this might be better than the conversation I was about to have with GAZ. I have plenty of spare hubs if that would help them develop these.

PS if I can get this sorted I will be selling a car set of very tidy Beta struts (minus top mounts) with new BB lowering springs and new Spax adjustable inserts all round. I could even have them powder coated to the new owners colour preference.   

Eric

For most owners finding a strut body with removable inserts to convert the mounts on is probably the way to go although Mark W's approach of converting sealed strut bodies for inserts is very sensible. 

Eric,

I have an interesting design bolt that adjusts the toe at the rear of my 406 coupe. I suspect it would do an excellent job of camber adjustment in Beta struts front and rear with a minor mod to the bolt holes.

I'll get you a picture - it might give you another option.

Stuart

Just a note: if you lower the rear, you may find the struts sit very close to the tyre
ok unless you're throwing around a track.


My hard coilovers saved my car/life this week, a car pulled out from a side road
whilst a LWB Transit was coming towards me, I just managed to get around the
car and back to n/side before stopping alongside the transit, very little roll and no
diving under braking. Certainly could not have done it in a normal Gamma coupe.

Geoff

Hi Eric,

Wow £1,400!!! Didn't Leda go bust or did they make a phoenix like resurrection? No wonder quoting prices like that. One would think they priced the job so high as they didn't want the work .........

Although it's very much off my radar at the moment, a set of AVO coilovers for the Beta seems a very good price. I wonder what you get for this?

How's the 'project Spider VX' coming on? Will it be ready for the summer?

Andrew

I don't know if they have ever done anything for Betas but these guys are reckoned to be very good and not overly expensive either http://www.protechshocks.co.uk/ (http://www.protechshocks.co.uk/)

With my latest project I had chat with Mark W and then some time to deliberate on the best plan to move forward, I have decided to take my sealed struts off the car and convert both front and rear to insert type using the Beta Parts Service.  As sealed units are becoming uber rare the inserts are the sensible way (IMO) to go. 

This takes out all future expense and aggro. Given that I can buy the parts to convert for £180 and then just buy new inserts.  I'll have mine shot blasted, powder coated and the conversion parts welded on but only needs doing that once, so it's not an ongoing cost.
 

Matt - Keep asking but what do you mean by 'The Beta Parts Service'? Are you referring to the collar that is sold on the Betaboyz site? Is this welded onto a sealed strut so it will accept an insert? How are this insides of the sealed unit removed? Who does/knows how to do the welding referred to?

Am I being a bit thick?

Neil

Yes I'm referring to the Betaboyz consortium that Mark runs.  Yes, also referring to the conversion collars that are welded on after the tops of sealed units are cut off.

I don't know if Mark supplies measurements so that buyers can do it themselves/give it to a local fabricator. But he can do the conversion for you if you send him your struts. I think he does an exchange service but check with Mark on that point.

To my mind, I have to start thinking differently. New sealed struts are unavailable, so it makes complete sense to convert to inserts.

I may well buy the conversion collars and have my fabricator do the conversion then I'll write up the "how to" procedure with all the key measurements included. Provided Mark is OK with this.

Really? Where from? I can't find ANY ANYWHERE. KYB, Sachs-Boge, Monroe, ALL obsolete, ALL no longer available. I'm currently awaiting information from lancia.co.za regarding availability but apart from that I can't find any apart from the Spax.

Andrew.

There's always new/old stock being advertised on ebay from time to time. If you want endless adjustability from original road stiffness to full on rock hard, spax are well worth the money IMHO.
Marcus.

There are Monroes listed on there right now but the seller doesn't actually have them- he thinks he's going to phone Monroe and get them sent out to the buyer but he ain't cos they don't have any left... :(

Andrew.

I got a full set of inserts (front and back seperately) from ebay over a period of about a year. The auction for the second set (back I think) didn't take off at all, and I think they only cost me £30 including postage. It's just a matter of keeping your eyes peeled.

As above my problem is that at least two out of my four struts are sealed units.

I have the Spax units and mine don't do that...

Andrew.

I picked up a pair of new Waiassauto OE rear struts (Excuse the spelling) last summer at the Lancia AGM and several new OE top mounts, so stuff is still out there. As has been suggested you need to keep your eyes peeled and of course have a bit of luck.

MOT time is fast approaching and not sure if my leaky rear strut (though by no means my main worry!) will make it again this year. Has anyone got a spare rear strut sealed or not. I can offer my current sealed strut in exchange if that sweetens the deal, once it is replaced, just so I can keep my car on the road while it is fitted/converted.

I searched and searched for konis and apart from a guy in Australia sellng for $1100aus not counting shipping.   Then, all of a sudden I found a guy local to me (Seattle) selling a pair of Koni fronts still with springs and hats installed for US $200...also came with a pair of Sachs rears.   Then, two months later got a matching set of rear Konis on ebay for  $110 shipped...

I got lucky....now looking for springs.  IAP would be top choice from what I've read.   

And I'll sell that pair of Sachs rears....

Are the rear HPE/Coupe strut bodies interchangeable? I know that when fully assembled the Coupe strut is longer, but is this accommodated by a longer insert shaft rather than a bigger strut body? I have now sourced 2 HPE strut bodies but no Coupes. Both are sealed but Mark W is willing to convert.

Just found a thread from October 2009 'Strut Bodies' which states pretty unequivocally that Coupe rear strut bodies are longer than HPE (I'd actually contributed but this saga has gone on so long!).

Subject to the above I have a sealed HPE strut (including spring, top mount etc.) if anyone wants it???

Neil

AFAIK coupé struts are shorter overall and I think it's all in the area above the spring platform also I think the strut turret is higher in a hpe to allow for additional suspension travel which is achieved by longer springs and strut. If you are modifying to take inserts maybe an hpe strut body can be cut down to coupé size(???)

It would be very useful if someone (or several someones) posted measurements of strut bodies  - that way newbies and slightly confused oldies could check.

For instance I’m 95% certain I've got the right struts on the front of my Spider BUT it sits too high at the front and it's possible I might have two sets of wrong struts - it would be good to know that they are definitely the right ones. I'll kick off by measuring the spare ones I've got tomorrow and posting the figures  - I'll also stick a diagram up to show where I've measured too/from.

I will measure my struts as I know they are definitely correct struts for the coupe.

Great idea to show where measurements are taken so it remains consistent.

I will collate all measurements and put into a single document.

Spider = Stuart
Coupe = Matt
HPE = ?
Berlina = ?

Stuart

On static ride height it is useful to realise that Gaz struts/ inserts result in the car sitting higher at rest than the original oil based types. Hence if you have gas struts on one end only with sandard springs the car can have an odd stance. The Spax gas strut inserts with the Beta Boyz lowering springs all round do sort this out very nicely. I first encountered this with Monroe Radialmatic (oil) and Monroe Gasmatic (gas) inserts about 20 years ago.

Eric

Eric,

Thanks for the idea (something I've seen before TBH) but these are not gas pressurised inserts.

Dimensions to follow.

I've measured my front struts - the rears I forgot I sold my spare pair so I'll measure the set on the car at the weekend.

I tried to make it as simple as possible so I measured from the upper mounting hole to the underside of the spring pan the flat section close to the strut body (there's a small hole there on my front struts don't know if that's standard) and from the top of the strut body down to the other side of the spring pan. I'm calling the dimensions A & B on the front struts and C & D on the rear.

Pics should make clear.

FRONT
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b178/HFStuart/Spider%20Engine%20Rebuild/FrontStrut.jpg)

REAR
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b178/HFStuart/Spider%20Engine%20Rebuild/RearStrut.jpg)

So far
A = 172.5mm
B = 77.2mm
C = TBC
D = TBC

Note mine are rebuildable ones, dimensions B & D might be a little different on sealed units.

If others could oblige we should be able to put together a simple little chart

For the S1 Coupe (Inserts F & R not Sealed units)

A = 172 mm
B = 77 mm
C = 305 mm
D = 65 mm

I will check my S2/FL Coupe which has sealed units fitted to see if they are the same.  But have to do this after the blue Coupe goes off to the body shop as theres no room in my garage at the moment.

Thanks Matt, looks like mide are the right ones then.

Can someone do the same for HPE and Berlina?

Stuart

Mark W has confirmed that HPE sealed struts can be converted to fit Coupes when they are converted with the collar he fits.